Re: javascript transpilers

On 29/01/2018 9:03 PM, Nick Sarbicki wrote:
> Going SPA when you don't know JS is very much a baptism of fire.
>
> Angular is personally my favourite too and essentially forces the SPA
> model. But it has a much bigger learning curve compared to Vue and
> React (the other two common names thrown about nowadays). The others
> are also easier to not force into a SPA model.
>
> Figure what's the minimum requirement first ;-).

Single page is pretty close to the way the application currently works
so that is promising. It is a lightweight training framework. Simple
architecture of courses, instruction(s) and questions with answers
aggregating a total score for the student.

I won't publicise the URL because the server isn't heavy-duty. But if
there is any individual interest I'm happy to give it off-list. Today I
released the beta to the first client who (generously) is using it for
his troops to do online training on how to use some Windows software.

So back to the minimum requirement ...

The single (question) page has previous-question and next-question links
which morph into previous-instruction and next-instruction links when at
the first and last question respectively. So that is the SPA similarity.

When you click the [Save] button after answering a question there is no
indication the answer has been saved without adding a line of text (via
the view) after answer.save()

Refreshing the page resends the [Save] and reprints the line of text
saying the [Save] was successful. Too clunky.

It was that behaviour which made me start this thread.

I checked out typescript and it looks great but it is javascript. It
seems to let you code in ECMAScript 6 which is looking more like Python
and as Nick mentioned, has a compilation step (which I suppose is like a
minification step anyway) to get it into the version currently supported
by all browsers.

That prompted me to look more closely at a few of the transpilers in the
link I posted in the thread-starter. One stood out for me ...
http://www.transcrypt.org/

It seems the compilation to javascript takes place in the CI process and
it can be debugged in Python or Javascript. You can use both javascript
and/or python libraries. Written by a Dutchman which is possibly
interesting ;)

The Angular thing is interesting.
https://medium.com/@chriscordle/why-angular-2-4-is-too-little-too-late-ea86d7fa0bae

https://www.infoworld.com/article/3213244/javascript/whats-new-in-angular-5-easier-progressive-web-apps.html

From those articles, it seems React is lighter-weight than Angular and
for me that probably means easier to learn. It is still daunting though.
Vue also assumes javascript know-how.

I think my best plan is to postpone a decision and make a start on DRF
anyway. No matter what happens that is a prerequisite.

I hope it isn't wishful thinking but Transcrypt looks more attractive
than learning javascript plus a javascript framework.

Thanks to all for the excellent and very professional feedback.

Cheers

Mike



> On Mon, Jan 29, 2018 at 9:15 AM Andréas Kühne
> <andreas.kuhne@hypercode.se <mailto:andreas.kuhne@hypercode.se>> wrote:
>
> If that is the case - I would recommend looking into creating a
> single page app - with Django restframework on the backend if you
> want to continue with Django. For the frontend you will however be
> required to learn some sort of JS framework - however this doesn't
> have to be THAT bad. I personally like angular 5 - which is
> written in typescript - a javascript based language - that
> actually removes most of the pain. HOWEVER JS knowledge is good to
> have anyway....
>
> There are other frameworks that don't require that much JS
> knowledge and Jason suggested GWT which sounds like it could be
> worth a shot, as long as it doesn't add to much complexity. The
> main reason for using that would be a large user base, so you can
> get help. The python transpiled JS versions don't really have the
> greatest user base :-)
>
> Regards,
>
> Andréas
>
> 2018-01-29 0:00 GMT+01:00 Mike Dewhirst <miked@dewhirst.com.au
> <mailto:miked@dewhirst.com.au>>:
>
> That seems unanimous :(
>
> Jani asked what problem I need to solve. Without going into
> analytical detail, all the code is serverside and now the
> project needs to move towards AJAX for user experience reasons.
>
> M
>
> On 29/01/2018 5:44 AM, Nick Sarbicki wrote:
>
>
> Agree with everything already said.
>
> Only thing I want to add is that while js has historically
> been a horrible language, the modern standards have helped
> rectify this. Modern js can be almost pleasant to work
> with nowadays.
>
> I wouldn't spend time transpiling python to js. Just try
> to learn js and maybe transpile from a modern standard to
> the browser standard. It's almost as easy as python to
> pick up.
>
> Django compressor helps greatly in the last case.
>
>
> On Sun, 28 Jan 2018, 16:49 Avraham Serour,
> <tovmeod@gmail.com <mailto:tovmeod@gmail.com>
> <mailto:tovmeod@gmail.com <mailto:tovmeod@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>
>     If you don't want and don't have the time to learn JS
> you may as
>     well consider outsourcing the frontend work, I've
> worked in places
>     that did just that and everybody was happy, the
> internal team
>     liked python and the outsourced company people liked
> UX and JS.
>
>     On Sun, Jan 28, 2018 at 6:09 PM, Jani Tiainen
> <redetin@gmail.com <mailto:redetin@gmail.com>
>     <mailto:redetin@gmail.com <mailto:redetin@gmail.com>>>
> wrote:
>
>         Hi,
>
>         You don't describe to what extent you need to use
> JavaScript -
>         IOW, what problem you need to solve with JavaScript?
>
>         Depending you needs you might get away with basic
> knowledge
>         and usage of some helpful JavaScript
> library/framework.
>
>         On Sun, Jan 28, 2018 at 12:44 AM, Mike Dewhirst
>         <miked@dewhirst.com.au
> <mailto:miked@dewhirst.com.au>
> <mailto:miked@dewhirst.com.au
> <mailto:miked@dewhirst.com.au>>> wrote:
>
>             I have avoided javascript like the plague.
> However it
>             seems I have to bite the bullet.
> Interestingly, there are
>             now a number of Python -> Javascript transpilers.
>
> http://stromberg.dnsalias.org/~strombrg/pybrowser/python-browser.html
> <http://stromberg.dnsalias.org/%7Estrombrg/pybrowser/python-browser.html>
>            
> <http://stromberg.dnsalias.org/%7Estrombrg/pybrowser/python-browser.html>
>
>             Where would be a good place to start a
> discussion on the
>             topic?
>
>             I am self-employed  with multiple demands on
> my time so I
>             cannot afford to allocate sufficient time to
> learn it let
>             alone undertake formal Javascript training. My
> hope is to
>             pick it up by osmosis and wonder if a
> transpiler would help.
>
>             Thanks for any pointers
>
>             Mike
>
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